Defining Strength

God Hears Her Podcast 

Episode 210 – Defining Strength with Sarah Stonestreet 

Elisa Morgan and Sarah Stonestreet 

[Music] 

Sarah: And I was thinking that is actually at the heart of what it means to be a strong woman, is not the big things, although those are strong. Those are used for God’s glory. But it all starts with those daily choices of Am I going to trust Him, or am I going to not trust Him? And so I think that the courage comes because you’ve built up that habit of going to the Lord and seeking Him like He is silver and gold, seeking that wisdom, you know? And so then when the time comes to actually make a bold stand, you’re prepared.  

[Theme music] 

Eryn Eddy-Adkins: You’re listening to God Hears Her, a podcast for women where we explore the stunning truth that God hears you. Join our community of encouraging one another and learning to lean on God through Scripture, story, and conversation at GodHearsHer.org. God hears her. Seek and she will find. 

Elisa: Hey friends, before we get started, make sure to download or print our new Bible-study show notes to fill out while you listen. You can find that on our website. Today, we’ll be talking with the host of the Strong Women Podcast, Sarah Stonestreet. Let’s get to know Sarah and what it means to be a strong woman. I’m going to be talking solo, and I’m very pleased that I get to have this conversation with Sarah Stonestreet. And before you say anything, Sarah, I want to just throw out this word, this phrase: Are you a strong woman? And when I hear that, I get a little intimidated on the one hand. I get kind of buff on the other hand. And then I get depressed. 

Sarah: Oh no. 

[Laughter] 

Elisa: Because it seems out of reach. So, Sarah, welcome and… and let’s have this conversation about strong women. 

Sarah: Elisa, thank you so much for having me. I can’t wait to have this conversation. I love talking about this topic. 

Elisa: [laughing] Well, let’s start off and just talk about, you know, who are you? Where’d you come from? What was your early life like? And gradually, we’ll move into: Were you always strong, or did you get strong, or what happened? But give us some background. 

Sarah: Sure, I’d love to. Okay. I grew up in a Christian home. My parents were first-generation Christians, and they love the Lord. And I’m so grateful they’re still around and still reading their Bible and loving Jesus and loving people. And I’ve learned so much from them. You know, I look back on my life and what a grateful heart I have to say I don’t remember a time where I didn’t know Jesus. But… but not in the sense… Of course, it’s grown, it’s gotten deeper. There’s been times of deep repentance along the way. But that I can look back, and it was just always part of my life. And so anyway, I grew up… My mom was in the military. I grew up in the … in Pennsylvania till I was 11. And then made a huge culture shift down to Mississippi right before I started… 

Elisa: Wow! 

Sarah: … sixth grade. So that was a fun time. Now I have four kids. I was an only child. I don’t know if I mentioned that. So four kids is a huge family to me. 

Elisa: It sure is. My grandkids go from 21 down to in utero, and I think it’s such a great stretch, because you kind of get everything, you know, at one time. And I love that. Okay, you go off to your regular school, and then did you go to college? Or what happened to you in your career and marriage and… 

Sarah: I went to a very small school. I’m going to name it because there’s probably one person out there that might know it. [laughter] … um… Blue Mountain College in Mississippi. And I got married my junior year of high school… I mean, sorry…um… I got married my junior year of college… 

[Laughter] 

Elisa: Please, a minor! 

Sarah: Sorry about that… 

Elisa: Okay. Okay. [Laughing] 

Sarah: Whoa! I got married my junior year of college, folks, not high school, and moved to Tennessee where my husband was already living and teaching at Bryan College. 

Elisa: Very cool. Did you have a career? Or you’re basically focused on mothering from the beginning? 

Sarah: Yeah, pretty much. I got married, and then we had kids a little bit later, not later, but like I was 23 when we had Abigail. So I really jumped into mothering, and I didn’t know what I was doing. And then I jumped into homeschooling. Still didn’t know what I was doing, but fortunately I had a lot of people around me who were just a little bit ahead of me, and I learned so much. So, I think one of the threads in my story is …uh… learning to ask good questions and observe people and learn from other people. So that has been huge. And then, as my kids got older, I did the children’s ministry at my church. I became the director of community outreach and things like that. But I don’t know if I’d call that my career, you know. It’s just along the way I’ve seen ways that my gifts fit into what’s needed kind of thing. So yeah. And then now I host the Strong Women Podcast, and that has been a blast! 

Elisa: Well, I want to hear about that. But I just want to pause and say, I think a lot of us simply are moved along the stream of life into spots on the river where we get out and make a contribution. And a lot of them are unplanned, unknown, and then later recognized as: Wow, that spot really fit my gifting, you know, and God really used me there. And I’m so glad I got out and invested there. So, kudos to you. I get that. So Strong Women podcast, okay, you mentioned having military parents, so my brain goes to combat and strength that way. But you know, how do you define strong women? And I’m very curious how that became an investment for you. 

Sarah: Yeah. Well, let me start by saying that how I figured out the name… because I agree with you, “Strong Women” is kind of intimidating. Like, well, what do you mean by that? And are you anti-men? And, you know, are you talking about weightlifting? I’ve had so many weightlifting podcasts reach out to me. It’s hilarious. I’m like, okay, you didn’t actually listen to the podcast. I see that. But often, in Christian circles, when we talk about femininity and masculinity, we grow straight to what one of my friends calls the chore list. Like, okay, women, you do this, men you do this. And of course, there’s a time to think through those things in a life-giving way, but we miss the beautiful picture of design, that men and women are created different on purpose, and that wherever God creates what seems like chaos, He brings harmony. And so, with the differences between men and women, it’s actually intended for His glory and for our good. And so, I wanted to say to my daughters like, “what’s a different message?” And I asked them like, “okay, here’s what you’re hearing. Think about some of the women in our life who are strong that you think they are doing the hard thing. They are walking faithfully with Christ where they are.” And you know what, Elisa? They start naming all these old ladies at our church… 

Elisa: [laughing] I love that! 

Sarah: … and I just about passed out cause I was like, “exactly!” You know, they named Miss Lucia, who, is an older lady who actually just passed away. And the girls said, “she’s strong.” And I said, “why?” And they said, “because she comes to church every week, and…” 

Elisa: No matter what. Mm-hmm. 

Sarah: No matter what. “She loves her husband, and they have a great relationship for so many years. And she is obviously in pain, but she asks us about how we’re doing.” Now, think about that. I want to like talk directly to your listeners. That is not, you know, highly qualified career building. That is the simple faithfulness right in front of you. And so, I think when we think we’re going to change the world, sometimes we skip over those small faithfulnesses because it doesn’t feel like it’s making a difference. Right? And so, anyway, I wanted, in the Strong Women Podcast, I wanted to show a different story about what it means to walk faithfully with Christ, which — spoiler alert — that’s what I mean by strong, 

Elisa: “To walk faithfully with Christ.” 

Sarah: Right, cause we aren’t strong on our own. 

Elisa: At Our Daily Bread, where we serve with God Hears Her, there is a… an offering called Unshakeable Moxie, and I’ve been thinking about it in preparing for our conversation, Sarah, that I think “moxie” is Our Daily Bread’s word for strong. It’s a kind of a confidence in God. It’s a faithfulness. It’s a committedness, you know, all those words. And in Unshakeable Moxie, they particularly unpack… 

Sarah: I like that. 

Elisa: … women’s stories of how they have done that. And so, when you think about that for your own life, I mean to move away from the stereotypes of what we think being strong is, whether it’s buff or dug in or unflappable, you know, those kinds of things. How have you seen that characteristic of strength grow in your own life, in your own relationship with God? 

Sarah: Yeah, I love that question. So I’ve kind of like come up with this definition that “a strong woman develops eyes to see the world around her with all its beauty and brokenness and to love with Christ’s love, with the gifts He’s given her, in the corners of the world where they find themselves.” So to break that down, well, what is it? How do you develop “eyes to see the world around you with all its beauty and brokenness?” You’ve got to start paying attention. You have to spend time with the Lord and listen. Because in Ephesians 2, it says that He has already prepared the good works for us to walk in. So in a sense, we can trust that when we wake up each day, we might have our to-do list. We might have our whole agenda; and I don’t know about you guys, but my agenda always gets side railed. But I can trust, you know, I can walk in that faithfully and trust that, okay, that’s not what… my agenda was not what He intended for me this day. Maybe this day was to sit with my dad who has Alzheimer’s and not get anything checked off my to-do list. Right? And so that to me is starting to see the world, like what is right in front of me. And what do I have to offer it? And it’s not that our faith is about the works that we do, but it’s that our faith compels us in love to act as Christ would act. You know what I’m saying? And so I feel like I’m developing that kind of restful diligence. And what I mean by that is I can trust and be diligent with what I’ve got and what’s in front of me. And what I’m talking about with what’s in front of me is like, first of all, my kids. The faces that are… that present themselves to me, that’s the person that God has called me to in this minute. And it’s not an accident, even if it’s the annoying person. You know? And so I think I’m… I’m growing in just learning to… to listen better. I’ve got a long way to go in that, but I think that may be the heart of where strength starts, is listening to our dear Lord and Savior who has the intention for His glory and our good in what He’s laid out for us each day. 

Elisa: You know, I’m thinking as you’re talking about some of the fruit of the Spirit, specifically about faithfulness. And that’s a tricky one as I’ve studied faithfulness, and I think that’s at the core of being a strong woman as I’m listening to you, so it really is rooted in that relationship with God. But as I’ve studied it, it’s impossible for us to be faithful. What we do is we lean into God’s faithfulness, and we reflect back to Him His faithfulness. So, it’s like… I picture ourselves as a mirror. So God is like, if you would, the moon or the sun reflecting to us. And we hold up who we are and reflect His faithfulness back to Him and how that pleases Him. You know? That’s really cool. And the other one is the whole concept of gentleness. Because the strength that you’re describing is a subtle strength. I mean, there’s also a fierce strength, but what you’ve talked about so far is this subtle strength of more of a meekness. Jesus was always gentle, but He wasn’t always nice about it. And there’s this concept of strength under control of a… a guided strength. A strength that is, if you will, commanded by God in our lives. He’s the one who directs us. And you just kind of described some examples of that, like with your father. If you set out to have a certain thing in the day that you’re going to do, but strength under control is being redirected by God’s good hand. Now, can you speak to us in terms of more of the courageous kind of strength that we might more typically think about, but what that looks like? For those who follow Jesus, maybe from a biblical perspective too. 

Sarah: Mm-hmm. One thing that comes to mind is we had Rachelle Starr on the podcast, and she started and founded this organization called Scarlet Hope. She started as a young woman, just praying, “Lord, help me see what’s around me, and how can I be Your hands and feet? basically. And she drove past this store, and she didn’t know what it was. Turns out it’s a strip club. But as she’s driving past, she feels the Holy Spirit say “The people in there.” And she’s like… 

Elisa: Whoa! Okay. 

Sarah: … So she does her little research and realizes it’s a strip club. And so she’s so nervous because she’s like, well, what… I mean, like I’m a 22-year-old girl. What am I supposed to do about that? Yeah. So she starts praying about it with a friend, and they met at the McDonald’s across from the strip club for a year. And their husbands were all in on it. They knew. And so… 

Elisa: Oh wow! 

Sarah: … after a year, she and her friend walk in the strip club. And I was like, “Rachelle, you are a beautiful blonde woman walking into a strip club.” She said, “I didn’t wear any makeup. I wore a turtleneck. I wore everything that I could think of to say ‘I am not here for work.’” But she met the owner. And she says, “I just want to show the love of Jesus to the women who work here.” And he’s like, “how are you gonna do that?” And she said in the moment she didn’t know. And she just said, “I’m going to bring them a home cooked meal.” And so that’s how she started, and she started just… 

Elisa: That’s beautiful! 

Sarah: … going in there. She recruited women in her church who, of course, jumped on the idea. Every week they would take a home cooked meal. And she said, “This was not boxed mixes. We did everything from scratch cause we wanted to proclaim to them through how we were serving them that they were worthy.” And so, of course, it’s grown to an international organization now, but it started very small. But it started courageously with that one step. But the other… like another example would be, and this one might hit home to a lot more of our listeners of just that daily choice of courage. I was talking with Joni Erickson Tada, who has been a quadriplegic for 57 years. She’s 74 now. She became a quadriplegic when she dove into a lake and broke her neck when she was 17. I’m sure you’re familiar with that story. 

Elisa: Love her. Yes. What a woman! 

Sarah: Ugh! She’s wonderful. And I’ve had her on the podcast twice, once to just tell her story. The second time was, I just think she’s top… she’s on the top of my list of strong women that I want to be like… 

Elisa: Good to know. 

Sarah: … because she loves the Lord so much, and she chooses to trust Him. And so, anyway, I was talking with her last fall. And she had been through a whole long bout of health issues. And one of them included 45 days in and out of the hospital with pneumonia. They sent her home with iron lungs that were so loud she couldn’t do anything but memorize Scripture, as you know, classic Joni. She’s like, so I memorized you know, Psalm this, that and the other. And I memorized… 

Elisa: So I got even more godly.  

Sarah: Yeah. I memorized Ephesians, or I don’t know. She just had… spouted it all. I’m like, “oh, that’s great Joni.”  And then she said, “this was the most powerful thing.” And it stuck with me, and I imagine it’ll stick with your listeners too. So she, previously to the sickness, had just enough strength in her right shoulder that she could feed herself. Like the caretakers could strap a spoon to her brace, and she could feed herself. Well, through this bout of pneumonia, she lost the strength in her shoulder. And I said, “Joni, that’s the one independent thing you have.” And she said, “Exactly. That was my first thought. And I started to complain. And I said, ‘Lord, this is the one thing I can do for myself.’ And I could not even get through the sentence before I realized, No, He has been faithful all 57 years of my quadriplegic life. And I can trust Him. And I know He’s doing something. I don’t know what it is. And so my small act of obedience in choosing to trust Him was I decided I would bless the hands of whoever had to feed me.” 

Elisa: Oh wow. 

Sarah: And she said, “God took that small act of obedience and gave me a more muscular faith.” And I was… 

Elisa: Muscular faith! 

Sarah: Isn’t that beautiful? 

Elisa: Yeah, that’s great. 

Sarah: And I was thinking that is actually at the heart of what it means to be a strong woman, is not the big things, although those are strong. Those are used for God’s glory. But it all starts with those daily choices of Am I going to trust Him, or am I going to not trust Him? And so, I think that the courage comes because you’ve built up that habit of going to the Lord and seeking Him like He is silver and gold, seeking that wisdom, you know? And so, then when the time comes to actually make a bold stand, you’re prepared. And so, I could keep going on stories, but I know your time is limited, but you guys should check out the Strong Women Podcast and look for some of those bold stories there. 

Elisa: You’re a great storyteller, Sarah, and I love this! And I love the analogy that you’re using, of working these smaller muscles into becoming stronger muscles. And, you know, that’s what the writer of Hebrews talks about, you know, in chapter 12, after going through all of these mentors, all of these heroes of the faith. We call, you know, Hebrews 11, the Hall of Faith chapter. But you know, the writer talks about strengthening your knees, your arms, making level paths for your feet so that the lame may not be disabled but rather healed. And you know that… He’s not just talking about working out your physical body. He’s talking about your faith, you know, that that’s how we grow. I love that. Can you give us an example of when you can specifically say you were intentional to use your strong muscles, your strong spiritual muscles in a spot in your own life? 

Sarah: Well, I don’t know if this quite answers what you’re saying, but one thing I’ve been really grateful for and, thinking a lot about, now that I have two girls going to college. … Uh oh, I might cry. There we go. 

Elisa: Uh oh! 

Sarah: Uh… but …um… 

Elisa: I like that. “Uh oh.” 

Sarah: … I’ve been thinking about those little years when they were so demanding. You know when you’re at home, you’ve got little babies, and you are just… You’re washing a lot of dishes, you’re doing a lot of laundry. Nobody really sees what you’re doing. Even your husband, who gets it the most, doesn’t quite get it all the way. And you feel not valued maybe sometimes because the work that you just continually do has to be done again the next day. And I’ve been thinking a lot about that because I’m now saying the old-mom thing where it’s like, you know, you see a young mom with babies and you’re like, I’m gonna say it. I can’t help it. “The time is going to go so fast,” you know? And then you’re like, why did I say that? Because it’s not beneficial to anybody, and they… they don’t even know what I’m talking about. And so one time I said that to a girl, and I came back the next day. And I was like, “Can I have a redo? Because that’s not what I meant to say. It’s like the old-mom thing. You can’t help but say it because it is true. It is so true. And in this season of life with my kids feeling like they’re flying out of the house, it feels so true. And I look back on those little years, and I’m so grateful ’cause I think that’s where God starts shaping this small act of obedience thing in me. Because I was loving them — not perfectly — but I was choosing to do those small things that I knew were important, but I couldn’t quite see the end goal yet. Like reading the Bible to them, going to church even when it was hard, committing to orient our family life around the church life, and being committed to getting up early to read my Bible, even when I didn’t feel like it. I look back now and I’m like, “Wow!” Those are the small things that I didn’t even realize how profoundly they were shaping me. I knew… I was hoping they would shape my kids, but I didn’t realize how much work was being done on me. 

Elisa: That’s so good. I love that perspective, Sarah. We think, okay, if I do A, B, and C strong, it’s going to shape my children in such a way that they become Hall of Faith Christians. And while there is a connection between who we are and who they become, you know, God doesn’t really hold us accountable, like as a report card for how our kids turn out. He holds us accountable for who we are and how we are trusting Him and leaning into Him. And that’s a really tough thing to keep straight in your head as a mom, you know, all the years as a mom. But I love how you just put that. He invites you into faithfulness. He invites you into trusting, and that’s what the woman does who is strong, is she finds herself growing in those very areas regardless of how things around her are changing. 

Sarah: Mm-hmm. Yes. Yeah, I agree. And as far as like strength for like how I’ve seen God use my giftings, I think… I think it’s kind of funny that I now do a podcast where I ask questions, because I thought that was my weakness when I was young. I got married young. I was 20, almost 21. My husband was six years older… eh… he still is. He’s… he’s six years older than me, and so John was already meeting with amazing people. He was already speaking. God has really gifted him with being able to take big thoughts and make them tangible for the everyday person. So he was already doing these kind of things, and I was like, I cannot hang with these people. They’re so smart! And so I decided, well, everybody likes to teach what they know. And so I just started asking questions like: “How did you get interested in this? And what should I read to learn more? I’ve never heard about this idea or whatever.” And so here I was like learning to ask all these great questions. And… um… a huge part of my education has just been asking people questions… 

Elisa: Oh, that’s so awesome! 

Sarah: … And then actually listening and going and reading the things they tell me to. And so… and now that’s my job is I get to ask questions. And so I think that’s just a funny thing that… the way God works, that no learning is wasted. And I tell my girls that all the time: You just pursue the next thing in front of you. And right now, for two of them, that’s college, and pursue that. Have an open hand to where that may lead. And you probably won’t do what you set out to do, but it’ll be so much more entertaining because God is going to take you on a trip, and He will not waste the things that you invest in right now. 

Elisa: It’s really rich, and I… I love how you tied the theme from early in your life through to today. Now you watch your husband, and you think, well, he’s doing all this fancy stuff. And you look at yourself and… and we can diminish ourselves. And instead, you embraced maybe what you thought you didn’t have and turned it into a strength of being a questioner. And when we become questioners, whew! You know, the world opens to us. It’s a humble position. It’s a powerful position, as are many. You know, there are… I know there are people listening right now who are going, Ugh. Oh, I feel really wimpy. I feel like I don’t have what it takes. And I know there are so many of us who are either facing a spot or have always been told we don’t have what it takes, or look around at other representations of strong women and think, I’m… I’m not that. Would you speak to her right now in whatever circumstance she’s encountering? And speak strength, the true strength that you’re discovering into her. 

Sarah: Yes, yes. First of all, I would say to you listeners — and I’m speaking it to myself too. If you don’t feel strong, that’s actually a great place to start because we aren’t. And that’s… that’s true about us. But with Christ, we’re a new creation. And not only are we a new creation, we’re not placed on the sidelines to go, Yay, look what Jesus is doing! All through Scripture He uses people. All through history He uses people. Just… He uses people in these small and big ways, but He…He does not just do things on His own. He could, but He chooses to use His people to build His kingdom. And so don’t think that you as a Christian, that now you get to sit and watch God work, just watch how God does things. No! Like you’re part of it, and you’re a participant. In fact, in 2 Corinthians 5, it says that “we have been reconciled,” and now we are reconcilers. And so that is… that is our huge mutual… both men and women have this huge calling of reconciling all things to Christ. And so, if you’re feeling weak, that’s okay. Start there. But you know the way to… to gain that strength, to build that muscle is to go after the Lord. He’s already going after you. It’s not going to take you long to find Him. And read your Scriptures every day, even when you’re not getting anything out of it, supposedly. You are because it’s living and active, and His word will not return void. It may not be in that moment that you’re hoping for, but it is forming and shaping you into being more like Christ. And so that’s where I would start. But I also want to encourage you. Okay, so now for the listeners who are like, okay, doing those things, I’m doing those things, I’m still feeling like, what am I supposed to do about this? Well, I would say here’s four questions to kind of think through. 

Elisa: Ooh, practical. Love it! 

Sarah: Yes. Here we go. These are questions the Colson Center uses a lot, and I love them so much. The first is: “What is good that you can promote?” So, as we’re asking these questions, think small scale. Think your corner of the world. Take inventory of what that is. Is that relationships? Is it maybe financial ability to bless others? Or a space to host? Think outside the box. What are all the things in your corner of the world that you have some capacity to control … or not control but invest in? Okay? 

Elisa: Mm-hmm. Influence. Sure.  

Sarah: All right, so, first question: “What’s good that can be promoted?” Second question is: “What’s missing that I can add?” So, are there giftings? You know, for example, I’m thinking small scale. You walk into church, and you’re like, man, there’s nothing for the young adults here. Instead of complaining about it, maybe that’s the thing weighing on your heart to do something about. Okay, so that’s just a small example, but I’m trying to help you think… 

Elisa: Super helpful! 

Sarah: … I’m not, Yeah, I’m not talking about like, is there an organization you need to start? Maybe there is, but often it starts very small. Okay, so, what’s good to be promoted? What’s missing that can be added? “What’s broken that I can work to mend?” Okay, there’s so many broken things in our… in our culture. We’re not going to fix everything. But what comes into your sphere of influence? What’s in your corner of the world that you can’t look away from? That you think, I have a heart of compassion towards this. Okay, well pray about that. And then the last one is: “What’s evil that must be stopped?” Now I can… I can think of several evil things going on in our culture right now, especially when it comes to how we view human beings. So what is evil that needs to be stopped? And how can I play a part in that? 

Elisa: You are really connecting the strength, that may start small, with influence. And I think we go straight to power when we think of strength. But a subtle and maybe more lasting impact of strength is influence. If I’m hearing you right, it’s an internal quality that is born out of your trust in God that He grows in His relationship with you. 

Sarah: Right. 

Elisa: And then it’s implemented in the influence that you invest in your world around you, maybe in concentric circles, you know, from what your smallest world out to other worlds. 

Sarah: Yeah. 

Elisa: As we draw to a close here, Sarah, what do you want to say? What’s bubbling up inside of you that God is prompting you right now with His Holy Spirit to leave as a lasting comment? 

Sarah: When I was new… a new adult. You know, I was just so young, and I didn’t want to read the Bible for legalistic reasons. I wanted to feel it, you know what I mean? I wanted to open it, and I wanted to be changed by it every single day. And… and so then of course, if you’re leaning on feelings to feel motivated to read your Bible, you just won’t. 

Elisa: Or you won’t get anything out of it, even if you do. Yeah. 

Sarah: Right. You’re doing it for the wrong reasons. And my mentor, every time I would bring something to her that I was struggling with, she would say, “Well, Sarah, how is your time in the Word?” And I’d have to say, “Ugh! It’s not good, Barbara.” And she said, “I would rather have time in the Word than breakfast.” And I was like, “What? I am nowhere close to that.” And she said, “You don’t get there by just jumping in and saying that. Like you have to practice it. You have to choose each day to make it a habit.” And habits are good things. They get downplayed as ritualistic. Well, rituals are… We’re humans. We are ritualistic kind of people. And so forming that habit is that small act of obedience where God says, I see that, and I am here. And…and so now in my life, I’m 43, and I’ve been practicing this habit since Barbara told me. I’ve been practicing the habit, whether I want to or not, of spending time in the Word. And I love it because we never get to the end of learning about who God is. And I feel like I’m there with her. I think I can say I’d rather have time in the Word than breakfast! And I’ve got a long way to go, and I’m grateful for that because I can’t wait to see what else I’m going to learn from just spending time in the Word. And so I guess that’s what I would leave everybody with. It is worth it. It is worth it. And Psalms and Proverbs, they all tell us, “Seek after it like it’s a hidden treasure.” Well, how would you seek after a hidden treasure? I mean, you’d go after it, right? 

Elisa: That’s right. That’s right. 

Sarah: … You’d… you’d ask all the people, Where’s the map? Does anybody have a map that I could find? Where’s the X on the spot of, you know, how do I… how do I climb this hill to get to that… that land? or whatever. And so maybe just start diving into that if you haven’t already. And if you have, I know you’re just smiling and nodding with me because you know. 

[Theme music]  

Elisa: We do know, Sarah. Thank you for that compelling and important conversation. Be sure to check out our show notes for a link to Sarah’s podcast and the Unshakeable Moxie docuseries. Find that and more at GodHearsHer.org. That’s God Hears Her dot o.r.g. Thank you for joining us, and don’t forget: God hears you. He sees you, and He loves you because you are His.  

[Music] 

Elisa: Today’s episode was engineered by Anne Stevens and produced by Jade Gustman and Mary Jo Clark. We also want to thank Tyler and Emmy for all their help and support. Thanks everyone.  

Eryn: Our Daily Bread Ministries is a donor supported nonprofit ministry dedicated to making the life changing wisdom and stories of the Bible come alive for all people around the world.  

[ODBM theme] 

Eryn: God Hears Her is a production of our Daily Bread Ministries.